Thank you for posting this, it is sooo beautiful. I have loved Joan Baez even longer than I have loved Leonard Cohen, and that is a long long time. Happy Easter to all Susanne
Ironically the Joan Baez song is just as out of context to Phil Spector being in prison as Fidler was in being a "witness" in the trial. Have you even bothered to listen to the lyrics? This song has no bearing on Spector and his lifestyle just as the past witnesses used in the trial may have had no bearing on his present behavior.
Reflect on what? Joan Baez was singing about the disenfranchised and those incarcerated for their color and/or socio-economic status. She was not referring to the wealthy and privileged few who can afford $1 mil dollar bail and an expensive army of lawyers. Who, by the way, will appeal until all is exhausted primarily because they are being paid to do so and not on principal alone. Whether the trial was procedurally flawed or not, leave Baez out of this. She would certainly not wish to be associated with the issue in this manner. We've worked with her closely in South Central, and I know how she feels about the issues.
You're taking the lyrics and putting them into your own personal context. She is talking about social justice and the disenfranchised. And that is what clearly eludes you.
My soul is not bitter, but my rational mind does comprehend what Baez is about and where her politics are positioned. I'm truly very sorry for Phil Spector and what happened to him, but there is an obvious disconnect using this song, and Baez in particular.
You are entitled to your opinion, but we could not disagree more.
When Baez sings "show me the prison, show me the jail, show me the prisoner whose life has gone stale" she is not speaking of people who should not be in jail or are incarcerated for political crimes or as a result of social injustice, she is simply pointing out that compassion is called for because we could all have gone down that path if life had treated us a little differently or we made different choices along the way.
When you gain a little more life experience it will, we hope, bring you a little more perspective.
Matthew 25:34 - This is what Joan is singing about. Read it, it will tell you just how much you really understand about what is right and good. It has nothing to do with money, but what's in your heart. Compassion for one's fellow human beings in the key to Heaven.
Blogonaut said: "When you gain a little more life experience it will, we hope, bring you a little more perspective."
You have absolutely no first hand knowledge of my life experience or my background. An ad hominem response like that is not really a very mature way to argue someone's opinion. It's logically fallacious. An assumption of my character has nothing to do with the logical merits of my arguments or assertions.
And it's quite ironic you would respond that way, given the context of Spector's own trial and appeal. ;-)
No one is calling you names, let alone (as in Spector’s case) a habitual abuser of women with firearms and a murder waiting to happen.
Pointing out that as you gain more life experience you will become more understanding of the personal failings of others (because you will also have your regrets in life) and that you will also become less narrow minded is not a personal attack. Instead it is one of life's truisms with which most people over the age of 55 are well acquainted.
This empirical truth, that with age comes wisdom, is hardly a fallacy.
That is why I am uncomfortable with jurors under the age of 30 serving on any kind of serious matter.
The inference that you are well under 30 years old is strengthened with your every post as well as your hyper-protestation on the subject of your youth.
The song urges compassion for others less fortunate--be they "guilty" or innocent.
Last, this blog has never advocated that Phillip Spector is factually innocent of shooting Donna Clarkson. Only that he has failed to receive a fair trial and that cumulative error in the court below caused justice to miscarry.
Blogonaut, I am 58 years old and a retired music industry executive.
If you would like a substantiation of this fact, then I'd be certainly open to communication regarding my age and background (including my capacity in the recording industry for the last 31 years.)
I had an opinion and you decided to disavow it based on an assumption of yours about age and experience and the presumed "bitterness of one's soul." My opinion was about the context of the Joan Baez lyrics specifically in relation to the Phil Spector case. It has no bearing on my capacity as a human being to be compassionate. In fact I said, "I'm truly very sorry for Phil Spector and what happened to him, but there is an obvious disconnect using this song."
As a professed legal expert this argument of yours is somewhat ironic if not paradoxical. Clearly you understand that. Or perhaps not. Nonetheless, observing from a judicial standpoint, it certainly casts some doubt on your self proclaimed credibility as a legal scholar.
Pursuant to 47 U.S.C. Section 230(c)(1) neither Blogonaut nor its editor are responsible for any content authored by third parties, including but not limited to posted comments.
16 comments:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eBn1_Mq8h0c
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dpyhl85MYmU&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5zfNx8qNKL0
Thank you for posting this, it is sooo beautiful.
I have loved Joan Baez even longer than I have loved Leonard Cohen, and that is a long long time.
Happy Easter to all
Susanne
Ironically the Joan Baez song is just as out of context to Phil Spector being in prison as Fidler was in being a "witness" in the trial. Have you even bothered to listen to the lyrics? This song has no bearing on Spector and his lifestyle just as the past witnesses used in the trial may have had no bearing on his present behavior.
Reflect on what? Joan Baez was singing about the disenfranchised and those incarcerated for their color and/or socio-economic status. She was not referring to the wealthy and privileged few who can afford $1 mil dollar bail and an expensive army of lawyers. Who, by the way, will appeal until all is exhausted primarily because they are being paid to do so and not on principal alone. Whether the trial was procedurally flawed or not, leave Baez out of this. She would certainly not wish to be associated with the issue in this manner. We've worked with her closely in South Central, and I know how she feels about the issues.
Joan Baez is reflecting on all of the persons we might be inclined to judge harshly--whether they started out in life rich or poor.
Accident, ill health, substantace dependancy, and other situations, problems and issues can overtake anyone.
The point of the song is that these things, but for our goood fortune, might overtake you, me, or our son, daughter, brother, sister, or cousin.
We are all tested in a split second, and sometimes it goes badly.
The song calls for compsasion, not based on net worth or how big your house is, but as human beings.
We are so sorry that the point eleudes you.
Jelosy of the wealth of others will get you nowhere except perhaps the place that Phil Spector now finds himself.
May God have mercy on your bitter soul.
Unanimous decision. Nice touch.
Mortie
Brilliant analysis (as usual).
You're taking the lyrics and putting them into your own personal context. She is talking about social justice and the disenfranchised. And that is what clearly eludes you.
My soul is not bitter, but my rational mind does comprehend what Baez is about and where her politics are positioned. I'm truly very sorry for Phil Spector and what happened to him, but there is an obvious disconnect using this song, and Baez in particular.
You are entitled to your opinion, but we could not disagree more.
When Baez sings "show me the prison, show me the jail, show me the prisoner whose life has gone stale" she is not speaking of people who should not be in jail or are incarcerated for political crimes or as a result of social injustice, she is simply pointing out that compassion is called for because we could all have gone down that path if life had treated us a little differently or we made different choices along the way.
When you gain a little more life experience it will, we hope, bring you a little more perspective.
Matthew 25:34 - This is what Joan is singing about. Read it, it will tell you just how much you really understand about what is right and good. It has nothing to do with money, but what's in your heart. Compassion for one's fellow human beings in the key to Heaven.
Blogonaut said: "When you gain a little more life experience it will, we hope, bring you a little more perspective."
You have absolutely no first hand knowledge of my life experience or my background. An ad hominem response like that is not really a very mature way to argue someone's opinion. It's logically fallacious. An assumption of my character has nothing to do with the logical merits of my arguments or assertions.
And it's quite ironic you would respond that way, given the context of Spector's own trial and appeal.
;-)
No one is calling you names, let alone (as in Spector’s case) a habitual abuser of women with firearms and a murder waiting to happen.
Pointing out that as you gain more life experience you will become more understanding of the personal failings of others (because you will also have your regrets in life) and that you will also become less narrow minded is not a personal attack. Instead it is one of life's truisms with which most people over the age of 55 are well acquainted.
This empirical truth, that with age comes wisdom, is hardly a fallacy.
That is why I am uncomfortable with jurors under the age of 30 serving on any kind of serious matter.
James,
Ever hear of circumstantial evidence?
The inference that you are well under 30 years old is strengthened with your every post as well as your hyper-protestation on the subject of your youth.
The song urges compassion for others less fortunate--be they "guilty" or innocent.
Last, this blog has never advocated that Phillip Spector is factually innocent of shooting Donna Clarkson. Only that he has failed to receive a fair trial and that cumulative error in the court below caused justice to miscarry.
Blogonaut, I am 58 years old and a retired music industry executive.
If you would like a substantiation of this fact, then I'd be certainly open to communication regarding my age and background (including my capacity in the recording industry for the last 31 years.)
I had an opinion and you decided to disavow it based on an assumption of yours about age and experience and the presumed "bitterness of one's soul." My opinion was about the context of the Joan Baez lyrics specifically in relation to the Phil Spector case. It has no bearing on my capacity as a human being to be compassionate. In fact I said, "I'm truly very sorry for Phil Spector and what happened to him, but there is an obvious disconnect using this song."
As a professed legal expert this argument of yours is somewhat ironic if not paradoxical. Clearly you understand that. Or perhaps not. Nonetheless, observing from a judicial standpoint, it certainly casts some doubt on your self proclaimed credibility as a legal scholar.
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